Embryo Query - Indoor or outdoor

[Jmk89]

A category of Plan that was indexed in the HPA2 Plan Gallery inconsistently is Embryo rubber models.

To me they look like indoor models but a number of them are in the Outdoor section.  Where do members think they fit better?

The same applies to Bostonians.

FWIW I think that both categoriees are better put into the Indoor section, what do you guys think?

[OZPAF]

I believe Bostonian were originally drawn as an indoor Duration class.

I don't know all that much about the Embryo class but they seem to be flown in outdoor contests.

John

[randoloid]

Embryo's can be flown both indoors and outdoors.  The Flying Aces clubs has a specific classification named Embry Endurance.  the planes launch ROT (Rise off table)

Copied below from the 2025-26 Rule book

VIII-3.0 EMBRYO ENDURANCE Competition for non-scale FAC endurance type sport models.
A. Design considerations:
1. Wing Area (WA) is measured off of the flat plan.
2. MONOPLANES not to exceed 50 sq. inches WA.
3. BIPLANES not to exceed 70 sq. inches of WA, with 45 sq. inches WA maximum for the larger wing.
4. Stab area not to exceed 50% of the WA.
5. Any part of any wing that sits on top of or passes (physically or projected) through the fuselage is considered wing area.
6. Fuselage volume to enclose a space 1.25 x 1.50 x 3.00 inches or larger.
7. The wing and tail must be built up and covered on both sides ("double covered") with Japanese tissue or equivalent.
B. Wing span: No limits, but refer to wing area rules above.
C. Landing gear:
1. Landing gear legs must be conventional configuration.
Example: two wheels on a single landing gear leg are prohibited.
2. Wheels must be 3/4 inches or larger in diameter, and must rotate freely on their axles.
D. Launch technique: unassisted ROG from a three-point stance.
E. Bonus points: Cumulative; added just once to the total flight points. Maximum bonus points—9
PTS. CRITERIA
1 3-dimensional exhaust pipes
3 3-dimensional wheel pants
5 Open cockpit with windscreen and headrest—OR
5 Full bubble canopy containing head rest and (at a minimum) a pilot's head silhouette—OR
5 Raised cabin with no less than a 30-degree windshield slant, referenced from the bottom of the wing (low wing on bipes).
F. Flight scoring: Total of three flights
G. Official flight: Official flight: 20 sec. minimum, 120 sec. MAX
H. Total Score: Flight score + bonus points.
I. Embryo Endurance may NOT be combined with any other events.

[Jmk89]

Thanks for the replies.

I will put the embryo plans that are in Outdoor back there.  If there are any in Indoor, let's leave them there.  A search should pick up all the plans so long as the word embryo is used in the keywords or description.

[lincoln]

I don't know if anyone still does 7 gram Bostonians, but they used to be a category. And then there were the 14 gram, or west coast Bostonians. Indoors, I should think that embryos would have better performance. I'm sure there are people who could get one down to 5 grams or so.

I don't know if flounder style fuselages were ever legal for 14 gram Bostonian, but I think they were for 7 gram at one point.

[Jmk89]

I don't know if flounder style fuselages were ever legal for 14 gram Bostonian, but I think they were for 7 gram at one point.

That raises an important point for those using the Plan Gallery.  If a model was presented as being for a class, I have adopted that class description in describing or indexing the plan for it, even if it would not comply with current rules.  So a model is called a Wakefield whenever it was built, even if it is not currently compliant with F1B class rules. 

It probably goes without saying that a class description in the Plan Gallery is not a representation as to compliance (at any time) with class rules. If you plan flying a model in a class comp. You have to make your own assessment whether it will satisfy the rules of that comp.

Sorry for that outburst of lawyer-talk, I suppose two law degrees and 40 years of practice skews the brain, so I just think that way

[lincoln]

I've seen some designs that appear to be pushing the limits, though I haven't used a ruler or protractor to check them.

If I had two law degrees, I'd probably have PTSD as well. I may have a mild case already from certain math classes in my own education. Plus if you snuck up behind me and shouted Gibbs free energy, I would probably jump a foot in the air and scream. There was a Gibbs gas station around here at one point, but I could never convince them to fill the tank for free. False advertising.

[OZPAF]

  That would be handy Lincoln.

John